bonsoir MP,
was this done with a digital camera and in b/w mode? or a scanner in b/w mode? and i would suggest a color picture with a closer detail. although this may be enough information for the cousin to use. i am a stamp collector and just like my images in color. b/w does help to show detail however. have a great evening. i can shut off my a/c tonight and open the windows. had super good thunderstorm to cool our evening off.

amities,
cajunsr.

again -2

You've got the castle upside down, you moron !
(Comme le pantalon de Dagobert).

This kind of design looks very familiar to me. At a guess, you should take the money.

I like chips with tartare sauce, or Worcestershire sauce.

Cajun, they are mostly surprising big, but very thin, quite like a milk-bottle top, assuming of course that your milk-bottle tops are like ours.

Rogermo

You've got the castle upside down, you moron !
(Comme le pantalon de Dagobert).

This kind of design looks very familiar to me. At a guess, you should take the money.

I like chips with tartare sauce, or Worcestershire sauce.

Cajun, they are mostly surprising big, but very thin, quite like a milk-bottle top, assuming of course that your milk-bottle tops are like ours.

Rogermo

LOL...ewe r lookeen from thee wrong side

mp

again - 3

bonjour!
d'après la référence du catalogue,je pensais que vous aviez une monnaie d'or .
Votre pièce est un "gros tournois à l'O rond" en argent de Philippe IV. Duplessy 213
Vérifiez si dans la légende il y a PHILIPUS c'est Philippe III
s'il y a PHILIPPUS c'est Philippe IV

Philippe III est le fils de Saint Louis
Philippe IV a fait brûler les Templiers

JPC83

Merci comme toujours, Jpc83 .

He thought from the catalogue reference that this was a gold coin. [There seems to be something wrong with that number you’ve given us, doesn’t there ? ].
It’s a silver gros tournois (the one with a round O) of Philip IV Duplessy 213.
Check that on the coin it says PhiliPPus.
If it says PhiliPus it is actually Philip III , not IV.
Philip III 1245-1285 was the son of St Louis, that is King Louis IX , 1214-1270 .
Philip IV 1268-1314 had the knights templars burnt.

Nicholas Mayhew’s “Coinage in France from the Dark Ages to Napoleon” has illustrations of very similar gros tournois from the reigns of Louis IX, Philip III and Philip IV , the first one having LudivicusRex around the cross rather than Philip(p)us. Mayhew confirms that only Phlip III used the spelling with one p in the middle.

The gros (fat) was a bigger coin that the denier (denarius, penny), in fact it was worth 4d . It was a Czech invention, also called grosso (in Italian) and more familiarly Grosschen in German. The first English groats were introduced in 1279 and were very similar to the French ones but with a portrait of the king instead of the castle. The last silver groats, still worth 4d but smaller of course, were issued by Queen Victoria, although similar 3d coins continued until 1941 and the 6d until 1967. Silver Maundy groats are still minted every year.

Cajunsr should bear in mind that the high workmanship he noticed in the French coins in the Duplessy catalogue was partly because they were gold coins. The Scottish coin was a groat. He should also note that the excellent sauce, renowned as far away as Switzerland, is called and comes from Worcestershire, not worsetershire .

Amitiés,
Rogermo

bonjour rogermo,
so let's get the facts straight on this coin of MP's. it is not gold, but silver struck earlier than the ones listed by our french cousin. the question remains is its value. obviously, could it more valuable than a gold coin or less depending on it rarety? and condition? as for my spelling on your famous sauce, it was a pun: 'worse-tershire'. gotcha.

amities,
cajunsr.

'whew, that was a long walk for an answer.'

bonsoir Cajunsr1!
je m'exprime en françaisje suis plus à l'aise!
Les gros à l'O rond ont été frappé en premier;d'abord sous Philippe III ,puis sous Philippe IV ,jusqu'en 1290. Ils sont un peu plus rares que les gros à "l'O long" qui ont été frappés à partir de 1290 jusqu'en 1295.
Votre Gros me paraît être en état very fine pas plus;jene pense pas qu'il se vende plus de 80 à 100 euros ; en état E.fine j'en ai vu à 150 euros.
C'est une belle monnaie gothique avec beaucoup de variétés;une belle collection à commencer... Mais d'autres delcampeurs pourraient vous en parler mieux que moi ,car je collectionne seulement les monnaies antiques.

au revoir cousin! JPC83

bonsoir cousin JPC,

a fine evaluation from you cousin. i am sure the american friend 'MP' will appreciate your help. it is not known what he paid for this silver or what he expects to sell it for. the top value of 150 euros seems a good price. but we have yet to hear from the english 'rogermo'.

une évaluation parfaite de vous le cousin. je suis sûr que l'ami américain 'MP' appréciera votre aide. il n'est pas connu qu'il a payé pour cet argent ou pour lequel il s'attend le vendre. la valeur supérieure de 150 euros semble un bon prix. mais nous devons encore recevoir des nouvelles de 'rogermo' anglais.

amities, merci et a bientot,
cajunsr.
cousin l'acadian
et beignets pour mon cousin et moi.

Bonsoir cousin JPC,
I thank you, kindly. Cajunsr1 & Rogermo, you have helped immensely. It is doubtless to rid this coin, from myself. I rather like it and was in conversatione with theGabriel, he wanted to trade me a grade 4 Atocha....I politely declined and he has yet to call me back....does not matter, as I think I am in Love with this coin, you know it has grown on me. At least it is silent, unlike my woman.

monkpiper

bonsoir MP,

being an ex-army medic has its advantages. when my wife talks too much, i have the cure.......

amities,
cajunsr.

I have looked at this coin with more intensity.

(Rogermo) said: He thought from the catalogue reference that this was a gold coin. [There seems to be something wrong with that number you’ve given us, doesn’t there ? ].
It’s a silver gros tournois (the one with a round O) of Philip IV Duplessy 213.
Check that on the coin it says PhiliPPus.

(monk) says
Yes, silver, it is. And yes, it is spelled with (2) P's. So this means it is from Philipp IV? And he was the one who burned the templars? A travesty, that was. I will not sell this one for it would be the first, I did not buy, to sell.

It is nice to know the valu and I thank all for the history lesson'. Please tell more when time, it permits.

Kind Regards to All,
monkpiper

I have looked at this coin with more intensity.

(Rogermo) said: He thought from the catalogue reference that this was a gold coin. [There seems to be something wrong with that number you’ve given us, doesn’t there ? ].
It’s a silver gros tournois (the one with a round O) of Philip IV Duplessy 213.
Check that on the coin it says PhiliPPus.

(monk) says
Yes, silver, it is. And yes, it is spelled with (2) P's. So this means it is from Philipp IV? And he was the one who burned the templars? A travesty, that was. I will not sell this one for it would be the first, I did not buy, to sell.

It is nice to know the valu and I thank all for the history lesson'. Please tell more when time, it permits.

Kind Regards to All,
monkpiper

I have looked at this coin with more intensity.

(Rogermo) said: He thought from the catalogue reference that this was a gold coin. [There seems to be something wrong with that number you’ve given us, doesn’t there ? ].
It’s a silver gros tournois (the one with a round O) of Philip IV Duplessy 213.
Check that on the coin it says PhiliPPus.

(monk) says
Yes, silver, it is. And yes, it is spelled with (2) P's. So this means it is from Philipp IV? And he was the one who burned the templars? A travesty, that was. I will not sell this one for it would be the first, I did not buy, to sell.

It is nice to know the valu and I thank all for the history lesson'. Please tell more when time, it permits.

Kind Regards to All,
monkpiper

bonsoir MP,
yes, it would be nice to have a more complete history of this coin. and perhaps our french cousin will provide more documentation and pages from the catalog he owns if possible. a trade for a coin from the 'atocha' is a tempting offer if that coin is indeed verifiable. the 'atocha' treasure was quite a discovery for the finder and his family. here is a link to share this fabulous story and the sunken treasure with the rest of the delcampers. :

Link (http)


amities,
cajunsr.

bonjour rogermo,

granted, the coins are similar. however, the workmanship of the dies is much more striking with the french coins, and seem to be more precise. the artisans have spent many more hours on their craft producing a quality product of the day. hence my observation. a result of the upcoming renaissance? or were the scots were just saving money as usual on man hours.

amities,
cajunsr.

I have read all this with interest. If you would now like to compare like with like, the Scottish silver groat with the French silver groat, you may agree that the Sottish one has a simple but effective and striking portrait, at a time when the French seldom tried to put portraits on their coins. On the other hand, the confused rather abstract design of the French groat is so ineffective that Monkpiper doesn’t seem to have recognised the “castle” (despite his own original description) and has placed it upside down every time.

Grüße,
Rheinmädchen

Why was Rogermo closed?

MP